I'm old enough to remember my first SS card that had 'Not to be Used for ID' in red letters printed diagonally across the face of the card.

Next up is DNA.

This is just more evidence that the true purpose of TSA has little to do with actual safety/security. What's happened with all the state votes against National ID and True ID made a few years ago?

I really hate this crap!

I have to align with people. I am looking constantly for those supporting liberty. I do not EVER want to give up a freedom. The Patriot Act was an act of treason. that's "so what"

Conservatives/ liberals say we have to accept one long list of policy positions or the other. We don't have to. So what if some conservaives / liberals have anti liberty positions?

yes

thanks tech. we already knew you were on that team :)

I don't know who is voting you down. I am not uncivil. I am strident.

if you are an author, the group is Conservative Libertarian Fiction Alliance. I am so sad about this. and shocked at national ID supporters

db looked up Godwin's bio on wiki. anarcho-anti IP supporter. nuf said

I am a conservative, slightly to the right of Genghis Khan according to one political test I took years ago LOL.

I did not support the creation of Homeland Security or the TSA. Both are just cases of giving the same crop of incompetents more power to do damage with.

ESPECIALLY the TSA...

I see below. hmmm.
I don't think you were exaggerating or labeling. No, I can't name every conversation I have and every article I read in which Conservatives or Progressives said that they would be in favor of this or that. It doesn't mean I didn't read it or don't know it and add it to my general knowledge of the world today.
and my "coin" often lands Conservative side up because they talk at the talk, and that's it. They say they are different from Progressives, and the only different is in how much tyranny they will support.

*italics, bold type WHAT!?! Would you be willing to provide the link to this discussion. If you, or many other Gulch Producers, have enemies, I have enemies, and I want to know who they are.

My wife and I went to Epcot a few years ago. Waiting at the airport for the flight home I noticed a man with brown skin. I guessed he was from India. He was working on his laptop and got up frequently to look out at the plane. We were both freaked out. I was about to report this when I saw TSA agents (3) coming towards us with a cart of some kind. Certain they would question the man I sat down. They walked over to a family and asked their 14 year old daughter to take off her coat and they searched her backpack. I know her age bacause she happened to be seated next to me later on the flight home. My wife said if that man gets on our plane we are getting off. He waited for another flight and all was well but I have no confidence in TSA protecting us.

Talk about compliant . Every time I stand in a TSA line, I get so mad I could scream. There we all stand in line, being treated like criminals, all guilty until proven innocent. And it's so stupid! So, yes, we Americans will comply, but what else can we do? I need to fly sometimes for work. But it makes me so mad!

well, you're parcing a bit. I didn't start with the argument although the article kind of lead with it. I waited until it got heated. what happened was, one member discredited the author with several statements. He missed clear points the author made. then I got frustrated. once conspiracy theory was brought up I was clear. how did Germany get so many people to be willing to comply? we already know that 10s of thousands maybe millions of illegal aliens will not go out of their way to comply with the new rules. but any citizen of the US who uses air travel will. now we set up up another mechanism to make you compliant. right now- you can fly within the US without a passport. but if I make you get another kind of passport" I take away your ability to travel and work perhaps. it's one additional way to hold something over your head for compliance. If you look in the comments section-people talked about some of the things we worry about-like FEMA taking charge during a disaster. well if I was thinking about controlling a population the quickest-giving FEMA more powers will be met with more resistance than tacking powers onto TSA. I am not trying to ratchet up fear here, just making a point. does it resonate? have govts ever used safety as a reason to gain more control?

I was accused of being uncivil and not willing to have a "good" discussion. rocky is offended enough by this discussion to leave the gulch.

rocky, we are just making an argument. we are not trying in any way to push Conservatives out-just those who support policies such as the national ID card to check their premises. I'm likely to offend EVERYONE on this site at least a couple of times, but why leave?

well you're pissed at me now. sorry. wasn't my goal. I am genuinely upset that this kind of an issue-a national rallying point which would get tons of support and push back does not. this isn't the first time I've had this conversation with my conservative friends rocky. maybe they'd listen to you on this over me.

Rocky do what you must, but you cannot deny that the NSA was expanded with conservative applause, or that conservatives push national ID cards just as much as regressives. The difference is that they say they are for freedom, while destroying it.

I do not know. I thought some of teh Conservatives in the Gulch could help on this. My hunch is illegal aliens, voting without ID. but why wouldn't a DL suffice? safety issues. it's hard to stay all calm while people who you think are allies are making arguments to empower the feds