Even Kids Know

Posted by mminnick 12 years ago to Education
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My granddaughter was over at the house thisafternoon. She was busy writing a letter to two teachers that had visited her class earlier in the day. I told her it was nice that she was writing a thank you note to them. She became indignent (as only a 10 year old young lady can) and replied" "It is not a thank you note. It is an apology. All of the class has to write one. Two of her class mates had acted rudely and disrupted the presentation the visiting teachers were giving.
Her teacher instructed the entire class to write an apology to the teachers. She very politely pointed out that only two of her classmates had acted poorly and asked why the entire class had to write an apology letter. The teacher replied that it was "nice" to point out the fault of others and all needed to apologize because the entire class was present. My grand daughter also mentioned that several other classmates asked the same question.
She asked me if that was correct and the "right thing to do". I told her no it was not correct and it was not the "right thing to do". I told her that the innocent should not be punished with the guilty. Only those misbehaving should be punished. The ones behaving should not have to write the apology note.
If a ten year okd (admitted very bright :) ) can see the inequity in the situation, one would think a teacher could also.
Each person is responsible for their actions, even fifth graders. They know right from wrong, good from bad. School should engourge this rather than teach collective/group guilt.


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  • Posted by LetsShrug 12 years ago
    As a parent (and a school employee) I would ask her to not write the letter, on principle, and I would call the teacher and have it out with her. This is nothing more than peer pressure instituted and encouraged by an adult that should know better. And perhaps the teacher is the one who owes all but 2 students an apology. Stress that your grandaughter is an individual, responsible for her own actions and not those of others. She is not part of a group, she is her own being. I'd be LIVID and would deal with this right away...in person if possible!
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  • Posted by cp256 12 years ago in reply to this comment.
    +1 for the Heinlein reference and to counteract the -1 gratuitously given by someone else.
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  • Posted by $ Genez 12 years ago
    You mention "School should engourge this rather than teach collective/group guilt."

    But that is pretty much the point of todays education system. To teach groupthink & groupguilt. We are supposed to all think together and work together for the common good. After all, what else is there?
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  • Posted by $ Hiraghm 12 years ago in reply to this comment.
    In "Starship Troopers", Heinlein (rightly) pointed out that "authority" and "responsibility" must always be commensurate.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 12 years ago
    Many years ago my wife worked in DC reviewing letters people wrote to the gov't about tobacco. She got a stack of letters from a school saying the gov't should regulate tobacco more. One 9 y/o wrote that his teacher asked him to write asking for more rules against smoking, but he thought people should be free to choose even smoking is dangerous. Now 15 years later she still admires that kid.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 12 years ago in reply to this comment.
    Why doesn't she write a letter with her own honest thoughts in it? It seems reasonable that teachers request a writing assignment but not for them to control the content.

    The teacher's position is a common mistake in business: holding someone responsible for a situation without their having authority to change it.

    I would go easy on her because it's more likely a mistake than a sinister plan to promote collectivism. This won't be the last managerial mistake she encounters in life. I wouldn't consider letting this mistake dictate the content. I would write a simple thank you note. This is actually a great lesson in interacting with clients who are making mistakes.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 12 years ago in reply to this comment.
    I went to two different schools in 2nd grade, due to a move by my family.

    I've told this story before, but I think it's relevant here.

    My 1st second-grade teacher assigned the class a math problem, after teaching us how to figure it. After we turned in our results, she chose my paper, and told the class that my answer was wrong; the correct answer was something else.
    I redid the problem. Got the same answer.
    She turned to the class, and asked them which of us was right. The all agreed that she was right. I did the problem a 3rd time, got the same answer, and shrugged at her helplessly. Several members of the class began to roll their eyes at me.
    Then she dropped her bombshell. In fact, she told them, my answer *was* right. She lectured the class on the importance of thinking for themselves, and when parent-teacher conferences came around, my mother came home beaming a proud smile at me, telling me how my teacher had bragged about me, "sticking to your guns".

    That profoundly affected me the rest of my life.
    Though it wasn't alone - http://humanachievementinitiative.wordpr...



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  • Posted by Hiraghm 12 years ago in reply to this comment.
    Dear Gentlemen and/or Ladies;

    It is with heavy heart I pen this missive. I had the misfortune to observe your presentation on (enter date). While I'm confident your intentions meant well, obviously the result was less than optimal.

    And so I feel compelled to offer my condolences on the disruption of your presentation.
    I'm sorry that it was so poorly conceived that it offered opportunity for less-disciplined members of your audience to respond rudely to you, our guests.
    I'm sorry that our teacher has so little authority over her class that she was incapable of controlling this rude behavior.
    I'm sorry that our teacher chose to use this as a learning exercise in group-think, and therefore has inflicted this number of insincere apologies upon you.
    I'm sorry to be a member of a society which places more importance upon the potential affront offered adult, educated professionals above justice for individual students.
    And I'm sorry for any lasting psychological damage you may have suffered at the hands of the two members of the class who chose to respond to your presentation in a way they found appropriate, but, obviously, our teacher did not.

    Good luck in your future endeavors,
    mminnick's grandaughter
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 12 years ago in reply to this comment.
    God bless her and watch over her.

    Help her write the apology; use this as a guide as to form (rather than a template):
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8vA0ANTU...

    (in another reply I'll share how I'd word the reply).

    mminnick, this is important, more important than you can realize now. When your granddaughter is old and gray, and looking back on the course of her life, this will be one of those turning points that determines her future, whether she ever realizes it or not. It may not affect her visibly or physically, but it will influence, deep-down, almost on an instinctive level, the decisions she makes in the future. If she does the right thing, gets slapped down, and sees no reward or value in standing up, her reflexes in the future will be to not stand up, again. It may manifest itself in a failure to achieve in college, it may manifest itself in an unwillingness to compete for a job, or a mate... if not handled well.
    You know the slap is coming; the trick is to support her through it and help her understand that this is what heroes are made from, and the harshness of the counter-attack against her only proves how righteous she is.
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  • Posted by 12 years ago in reply to this comment.
    At this point she hasn't done anything. She won't be back in class until Tuesday. She told me she wasn't gong to turn it in. I told her to be ready for a detention for not doing as told by the teacher. She say, and I quote " I not worried. You;ll protect me and teel the teacher I don't have to have detention because I'm right".
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  • Posted by $ minniepuck 12 years ago
    I'm glad you were able to talk to your granddaughter about this. What did she end up writing (if anything)?
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