OK-Here Is the Actual Conference That We Had Such Uproar Over Last Week: If You DO NOt Want A Christianity Discussion, Don't Read This Post

Posted by khalling 11 years, 9 months ago to Philosophy
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For my Christian friends in the Gulch. Understand up front that many Objectivists will object to Mr. Thomas' and Mr. Henderson's views (mark). However, I think it is constructive to have these kinds of debates. I have not watched it, and will weigh in after I have seen it.I'm also not going to respond much, since my views are well known. But some of you might find this interesting

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  • Posted by Robbie53024 11 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't read fantasy.

    There is no reason that Objectivists and Judeo/Christians cannot co-exist.
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  • Posted by jrberts5 11 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You are incorrect. Read Leonard Peikoff's book "The Dim Hypothesis." It will explain that the Christians are the most likely candidates to cash in on the statist/collectivist controls and establish a religious totalitarian dictatorship. Read that, then come back and I will discuss this matter with you.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 11 years, 9 months ago
    Excellent panel discussion. Thanks for linking it.

    I found Prof Kotters point near the end to be particularly salient. I did not personally see Thomas Jefferson, but the evidence of his existence is such that I believe that he lived. Did he write the Constitution? I did not see him do so (and I'm not sure of whether there is historical documentation by any other 3rd party that states that they saw him physically writing it), but he purported to do so and there is no contrary evidence, so I will continue to conclude that he did until such evidence arises.

    Is there evidence that Jesus of Nazareth existed? Yes. Is there evidence that he performed acts that could not have been done by any known means of the day? Yes, there is documentary statements to what occurred and there is the Shroud of Turin. Despite all the debate about carbon dating etc. this is physical proof that defies explanation. I saw a 3D representation of the shroud in the Air Force Academy chapel. This piece of cloth was not painted or stained by any known mechanism as the image is only a few molecules deep. Nor could it have been painted by any reasonable technique, as when it is laid out flat, the image is distorted. The only way that the image is "real" is if it were wrapped around a human body as was the custom at the time of the crucifixion. This also bears wounds as described as what Christ suffered in the Passion.

    If Jesus lived, died as evidence documents, and rose from the dead - again documentation says that this happened - then I see no other explanation than that what he was was God. Ipso, facto, if Jesus is God, then God exists and everything from that follows.
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  • Posted by Robbie53024 11 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Did you watch the video at all?
    The common enemy is Statism/Collectivism.
    Objectivists and people of faith (here they concentrated on Christians, but I would include nearly all faiths with the exception of Islam and some very few others) share many common perspectives on life. In fact, as agreed to in this panel, except for the difference in whether there is a deity or not, all the rest of the reasoning that follows to the principles of morality end up in the same place. One foundational principle is right, but if you get to the same place, does it matter?
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  • Posted by $ WillH 11 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
    One has nothing to do with the other. Either you were not around to see what happened and why, or you chose not to pay attention to it. I am a religious person, as are quite a few others here, and we have no "censure" as you put it. I am not trying to stick my nose in, just saying the first part of your statement has nothing to do with the last part. In fact, the things he said would have earned him a reward known as a Banhammer on just about any other forum I have seen.
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  • -1
    Posted by rlewellen 11 years, 9 months ago
    No, you want to filter out whoever doesn't support your view or do as you say. That's not a debate. Free Hiraghm from censure.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I tried giving you a thumbs up, but I still can't.

    Thanks for the olive branch, anyway.
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  • Posted by khalling 11 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
    you know, me too. I was not particularly looking forward to it, due to the dissonance I expected in the discussion. But I was surprised what I picked up from the presentations and even more interested in the Q&A. well worth watching
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  • Posted by $ rockymountainpirate 11 years, 9 months ago
    An excellent discussion. This is worth listening to more than once. Like kh, the most important concept I came away with is that, there is no morality without choice.
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  • Posted by khalling 11 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
    r, your comments are unfounded. Please consider watching the video and commenting on the point of the post.
    I had no decision in Hiraghm's dilemma. The admins made a decision about THEIR site. Take your concerns to the admin through your own post or PM. But, please, I ask that you stay on topic for this post. Thanks
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