Galt's Gulch

Politics: Are you ready for ObamaCare home visits? | Best of Cain

Posted by $ AJAshinoff 11 years, 11 months ago to News
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Bah, this stole one of my soon to be added to Fallacies of Vision short-stories. Buckle up, if the R's can't curb this monster we're going to lose so much freedom its not funny.
SOURCE URL: http://www.caintv.com/are-you-ready-for-obamacare-ho

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  • Posted by $ Mimi 11 years, 11 months ago
    I’m crying. I went to pick up food at my favorite restaurant and I got into it with a couple of democrats about Ted Cruz on the floor.

    I know it was all for show. I know it’s ridiculous that the GOP sends me an e-mail asking for money to support Cruz when the Powers -To-Be have written him off as an upstart incapable of being the GOP front runner, however, I am only concerned with this from my POV. This is the first time in my fifty-one years of history that any program has become law that required me to buy something or otherwise apply for government help.

    I can’t do this. I’m too independent. I have gone years not owning anything, but not owing anyone. I make my choices some of them have been downright awful, but I never expected the government to have the right to come into my personal life and make choices for me. Please, please...I’m begging you stop this bill. This feels like the death of America to me.
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  • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 11 months ago
    This is not a case of a threat to freedom. There's nothing wrong with funding home visits.

    Even the article can't make the case. At the end they rightly say when someone's giving you something you need (in this case the gov't) they have power over you. That would be true regardless of whether home visits were funded.

    The article makes the claim that gov't insurance encourages the insurer to investigate your private life. This is true regardless of the who the insurer is. I agree it might be a bigger problem w/ the gov't b/c they have the power to make things illegal.

    This is related to my complaint that having gov't pay for things wastes public discourse time. For example, there is some disagreement on how often women need mammograms and which vaccinations kids need. In a free market, people would just pay for what they personally think they need. In a system like PPACA, it becomes a matter for policy debate because our tax dollars are paying for part of it.

    I share some of the criticism of PPACA, but on balance it does more harm than good. That's a debatable claim. I reject the histrionics, though, about PPACA taking away your freedom. Mostly it solves the problem of labor immobility due to jobs being tied to insurance and the problem of people not being able to insure against the peril of a long-term illness. It also does something to help the poor have access to the new expensive treatments and interventions in the medical world. As gov't initiatives go, PPACA is shooting par.
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    • Posted by $ AJAshinoff 11 years, 11 months ago
      This is an incremental step. Sure, its logical...that is their wedge in (after they rammed Ocare down our throats). Once they've compiled enough data (my wife, an ORN, just gave me an example of this a few minutes ago) they will start dictating your actions.

      Freedom is seized from you,. You choices, your action, and how you navigate your world (what his country is supposed to be about) are becoming less and less under your control. I suppose being in any society sacrifices some freedom - its just that now THEY will dictate how much and how little freedom you can have AND you get to pay for it.

      "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety".

      Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759

      We're all going to die one day, its unavoidable. Why not use what time you have your way?
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    • Posted by Rozar 11 years, 11 months ago
      Yeah it's a legitimate thing to ask for, if their going to be providing the health care at least their investigating the subscribers to make sure their either getting what they payed for or their not cheating the system. Problem is that your forced to subscribe. Sorry I'm a healthy 23 year old male, I don't want health insurance. If I do I'll sign up for it and I'll decide if I want to go to a provider who shows up to investigate my claims. If they state it in the contract I'll sign it. I didn't sign up for this.
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    • Posted by LetsShrug 11 years, 11 months ago
      You're okay with Bocare home visits? You don't see that as an attack on your privacy and your liberty? IN YOUR HOME???? I hate when someone comes to my door that I don't know...I feel they're being intrusive and rude for interrupting my day unannounced... I can't even imagine how I'd react to a bocare rep showing up acting like their visit was "voluntary" on my part. Wait..yes I do know how I'd act. The fact that you're not bothered (or even close to being up in arms over this idea) just shows that you're okay with the foot that's in the door, the wedge..the nudge of a gov take over of your life. You scare me.
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      • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 11 months ago
        This is not different from the census or a salesmaker bothering you. It's not a thinly veiled excuse to harass political enemies of those in power. It's not even as intrusive as having a speed limit that is usually not enforced but can be arbitrarily used to question any motorist who doesn't obey the unenforced limit.

        It's similar to how Medicare reaches out to seniors who are eligible for the program but fail to apply, usually because they're not on top of the dates and details.
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        • Posted by LetsShrug 11 years, 11 months ago
          I'm not arguing that it's different...I'm saying it will only get worse now that their foot is in the door... a LOT worse... but if you don't want to see it for what it is then you won't... until the foot comes through YOUR door. "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality." AR "The truth is not for all men, but only for those who seek it."
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          • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 11 months ago
            "if you don't want to see it for what it is then you won't"
            I would say the same to you. I think you and AJAshinoff are nuts about this one issue. If the healthcare overhaul turns into a backdoor police agency, I'll totally eat crow.
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            • Posted by $ AJAshinoff 11 years, 11 months ago
              Well the practical application of laws such as these are exactly why I wrote my books. The offer is open.. I'm not nuts...In fact I'm a quite rational conservative American veteran.
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            • Posted by $ johnrobert2 11 years, 11 months ago
              With or without the feathers? Raw, fried, in a soup, or roasted? I'm no chef but I can do that much.
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              • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 11 months ago
                Remember, you're saying a healthcare program will turn into an oppressive police agency. That's means in more than one or two freak cases, you expect to see healthcare workers collecting evidence that gets people jailed or denied vital healthcare. Simply bothering people during dinner doesn't count. Helping elderly people can't figure out the paperwork or get mobility assistance devices ordered does not count. I need to see people jailed or denied critical care, and more than one or two weird cases. If that happens, I'll be proven a fool, like those people who said Patriot Act provisions would _never_ be used on anyone but "terrorists". But if all they ever do is help people get signed up for benefits, even "benefits" that you think aren't that beneficial to the recipients, you guys will be fools, like those who think jet contrails are used by the gov't as mind control. Time will tell!
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                • Posted by $ johnrobert2 11 years, 11 months ago
                  Would families being torn apart because the parents have some innocent quirk, such as owning guns or (God forbid) disciplining their children with a spanking, which the government considers an unhealthy behavior be considered proof enough or must it be more drastic than that. Remember, Nazism had its apologists who saw nothing wrong. Until it was too late.
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                  • Posted by CircuitGuy 11 years, 11 months ago
                    Kids being taken away b/c of guns or spanking on a regular basis because of evidence collected by the a health program that would not certainly have been collected by other policing agencies would count. If home visits connected to PPACA play any significant role in policing, even for bona fide crimes, I will be completely wrong.
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    • Posted by gblaze47 11 years, 11 months ago
      This much like in Canada where Dr.s have the final say over if you get medical help or not, family isn't part of the decision. I have an aunt out in B.C who always says "she hopes they'll give her the care she needs" whenever we talk, she's always afraid to make 'waves' for the fear they'll hold any type of medical care from her. They are under Government control and they don't even know it.
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  • Posted by $ johnrobert2 11 years, 11 months ago
    Gee, I fit about one of those categories. Of course, I haven't applied for a subsidy, haven't put my name on the exchange (Ha Ha. TX doesn't have one.) Don't smoke, child doing well in school, not under 21 and pregnant, not in trouble with child welfare. Damn, I just can't lose for winning. Guess I'll have to try harder.
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