True. Would be speeded up by the leftist ideas producing total collapse of the economy I think this is going to happen as the left is so anti reslity

"protection money" paid to the mob: do you mean kind of like what the government scheme is currently? lol.

No, the security agencies would take voluntary payments only. The mob (and the state) payments are always involuntary. The non-aggression principle needs to become ingrained in society.

The idea is that the security agencies would forcefully bring the mob, the states and any other security agency that decides to go rogue to justice. Of course, the only way that would happen is if the collective power of the 'good' security agencies is much greater than that of the 'bad' security agencies. I don't know yet how this would take place except maybe if the masses suddenly begin to see their governments as their enemies, stop supporting them financially and begin supporting their abolition.

Restitution from people that have nothing: that is what labor camps are for. Alternatively, the free market can come up with something else.

Restitution for murder: Yes there is.

The person who was murdered was already selling their time in exchange for money. Everyone does that, btw. All you have to do is multiply their hourly rate by the time they had left over in their life (minus sleep and work). This would be deposited with the murdered person's estate. I would presume there would also be additional damages to third parties which need to be paid.

There is no "restitution" for murder. And you can't get restitution from people who have nothing and think that makes it ok to take from others.

And what makes you think the "security agencies" would operate on any moral basis. It sounds a lot like "protection money" paid to the mob.

I don't see that as a major improvement.

I am assuming by 'bad' people you mean those that steal, kill, etc.

I don't know why you think existence of 'bad' people would suddenly make no-system not work. Please explain your reasoning. I would assume it is because you think everyone would devolve into raping and pillaging without a state.

Obviously, the free market has a solution. I did propose a way to deal with it. Allow the free market to spawn insurance-like security agencies that would collect restitution (by force if necessary) from violators. This is assuming a 'universal law' can be developed (via logic, not having these agencies declare and enforce arbitrarily laws), and also assuming this universal law (by logic) allows restitution based justice system.

I would argue that the current situation is worse than if the free market was allowed to work. See, the state currently prevents good quality service of this type from existing by monopolizing this area of the market, then not providing the service. For example, current law is punishment based, not restitution based. So, victims can't even get paid back damages in most cases. Also, sometimes police refuse to go into some areas, thereby depriving their 'customers' of security services. Also, the states are basically huge mafia organizations that sometimes go to war against each other, causing a great deal of destruction and harm to their 'customers'. So, I would argue the current situation is worse than in the no-system scenario.

Also, I believe that people are generally good, otherwise civilization wouldn't exist. What causes them to turn 'bad' is the SYSTEM. It enslaves them. They feel it but they are unable to figure out what is actually going on. They return the favor by stealing back what was stolen. The problem is, most of the time they rape and pillage the wrong entity. My proposal is, stop the enslavement and you solve most of the problem.

It may take 50 years for the 'programming' to be reversed and yearning for freedom to arise again.

Stay under the radar. Stop supporting the current statist regime. Let them fall under their own weight when the currency collapses. Live independently outside of their grid. Read Atlas Shrugged. There are so many regulations that I am so confused that its hard to know what to do....

AS had it right. Let the USA as we know it fall and fall hard before enough people want to make it over better. There is no hope at the moment to stop the tide without a collapse to let people see what socialism and statism really has to offer.
Go Galt.

You're non-system depends on everyone being good people. They are not.

Thumbs up.
Pray for America, but keep your powder dry.
Or as my dad sang in WWII "Praise the Lord, and Pass the Ammunition"

For me and mine, the evil is and has been here for longer than I've been alive. For me, I can and will be moving a bit further away from city/suburbia in the very near future. It's a short-term fix, but there is no better option for this 75 year old grandmother who has seen many better days than these. I hope Israel has the backbone to bomb Iran's nuclear processing plants and oil fields into clouds of toxic smoke, for the world's sake. If a BIG war is the result, it will be intetesting to hear what the media has to say versus what actually happens. Between all the Jewish religious holidays coming up and the election here, these next 4 weeks should be loaded with actual news.

Based on my grand theory of everything, the trick is to move to a place with the least predation (or soon to be). It would probably be a place recently destroyed by a war or some other disaster, where the only people that survived are the productive ones. You are looking for the least corrupt society you can find, or where corruption is on a major decline. This place will survive and thrive post-collapse. Of course it should probably be isolated and remote so that it wouldn't be vulnerable to predation from outside.

Oh ya, have jarheads decide everything, what can possibly go wrong.

What we need is no system: voluntarism and the free market. As soon as you use violence illegitimately (to 'enforce' made up 'laws'), all bets are off. You are violating reciprocity in relationships between individuals. Why would I want to play fair if you aren't? Fuck you then... I'm letting this motherfucker burn down. In fact, maybe I'll throw some gasoline on the fire...

Bingo!
When you get the time, please read Joel C. Rosenberg's amazing 5-book series:
The Last Jihad (2002)
The Last Days (2003)
The Ezekiel Option (2005)
The Copper Scroll (2006)
Dead Heat (2008)

In the first book, The Last Jihad, the main character Jon Bennett meets a Messianic Jew named Eli Mordechai. Mordechai becomes Jon's mentor and advisor (like the Mordechai in the Bible).

He used to run the Mossad, and can see around corners. Here's what he had to say about us Americans, every time we got caught with our pants down during an attack:

“The problem with you Americans is that you don't believe in evil. A man like Saddam Hussein, for example. Saddam tells the world for years that he has a territorial claim on Kuwait. Builds up his armed forces. Develops weapons of mass destruction. Moves troops to the border. Signals everyone he's going in. But all the boys and girls at the CIA and DIA say Saddam won't do it. Just saber-rattling. Just flexing his muscles. Couldn't possibly invade. Why would he? It would make no sense. It would be irrational. No arab nation has ever invaded another arab nation. Why start now? Saddam was painting us a road map, and you simply didn't believe he'd start the car and take the trip. Saddam Hussein was not a lunatic and in that case, he wasn't a liar. He was rational and calculating and evil. So he told the world what he was going to do – commit an act of evil, not an act of madness – and then he did it. It took a bunch of highly paid analysts with Harvard degrees to completely miss the simplicity of the moment.”
“I believe the terrorist is both capable and prone to acts of unspeakable evil, and you don't. I'm right, and you're wrong. It's not because I know more than your government. I don't. I know less. But I believe that evil forces make evil people do evil things. That's how I anticipate what can and will happen next in life. That's how I got to be the head of the Mossad, young man. And why I'm good at it. It's going to be one hell of an August, and my country is going to suffer very badly because your country doesn't believe in evil, and mine was born out of the ashes of the Holocaust” – “The Last Jihad”, by Joel C. Rosenberg

This is Biblical, of course. I now have a few friends who are using that term..."Biblical". Total darkness and destruction to envelop the earth for a long time. When a little old lady gets a bloodlust glint in her eye talking about Trump possibly getting his head blown off on live tv...also Biblical. That's not a normal human reaction. Not by a long shot. That's demonic.

Will that be the signal for invasion by the little gray aliens, or the lizards?

“If we lose freedom here, there is no place to escape to. This is the last stand on earth.”
― Ronald Reagan

Once America falls, the whole planet will enter Dark Age 2.0.
There will be nowhere to go.

A massive Libertarian resurgence, supporting Freedom and Responsibility. This could be borne from logic.

I said it before here that Freedom = Responsibility and responsibility = Freedom. You can not have one without the other, unless you compel others to be your slaves. (of course I was jumped all over by the idiot Listerine-spewing, EWE).

What frustrates the crap out of me, is people giving up on this argument. Religion is not a solution to change anyone's mind, yet the Religican's continue instituting Christianity in government. The above is simple, logical, rational and fair. Progressive ideology is none of that, but forced, totalitarian slavery, while asserting fair practice is actually forced.

"Bread and circuses" were originally provided by Roman emperors for subjects who could not vote.
Nevertheless, it kept lots of idiots happily pacified.

The US is in decline, surely. My antennae is up and wriggling over this. Decided that if they manage to put Coke-mala in the White House I'm probably done buying much of anything other than necessities to keep the household running. Will be looking at options for an escape plan. People say that once America's trip into the gutter is complete there'll be nowhere safe. I don't buy that. I see moving as buying time. I felt like I bought about two decades when I left California for a freer state. Maybe not that long. But, I did buy some time...

Democracy is dead when people figure out they can vote themselves 'Bread and circuses'. It is then replaced by tyranny.

This is why the founding fathers put a republic in place rather than a democracy. And in a legitimate republic, the vote is granted only to land owners, as they are the ones with skin in the game. Giving the vote to moochers and looters ensures that mooching and looting will continue, and even accelerate.

i hold little hope due to the lazy nature of people

we need a system in place similar to the one in the book StarShip Troopers

as was planned when it was done by politicians, giving the vote to all over 18 just meant the politicians buy votes by giving away other people's stuff, to those that did not earn it, the Gate-Keepers of the Supreme Court have ignored their duty to stop that from happening